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 Post subject: DRPA+ Bose 802 / 502 and Yamaha SW118 config question
PostPosted: Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:14 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:29 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
Hey Guys,

New to the DRPA+ thing and am attempting to modify my existing setup which is a Mackie 3204 to a dbx166 out to my Bose 802C controller out to a PLX3002 to the highs, 2x 802 per side, and a PLX3402 for the lows, 1x 502BP, per side. To date the sound has been pretty good for our band but I really am missing the sub bass that my 502's can't reproduce as they roll off at 55hz. So I have purchased a pair pf Yamaha SW118's and a DRPA+. So my question mainly is should I attempt to run the SW118 in addition to the BOSE setup and cross them at 90hz or replace the Bose subs completely. My concern with removing the Bose subs would be the punchy mid-bass that comes from the 12in.

Thoughts?
Questions?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:19 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:11 pm
Posts: 3244
I would try it several ways. The Bose has a 55-150 range, so Id try 90-135 (1/2 oct), 70-135 (1 oct), 60-120 (1 oct), 70-100 (1/2 oct). Match the tops and subs filter points, then try just the sub and tops. It is going to be a lot of work, but ....
I would make all connections Highs, Mids, Lows and set up a preset for each one. Tweek each one to make it sounds best, then go from preset to preset so that you have the best auditory recall. Don't compare all of them together. Compare 1 to 2. Select a winner. Compare 3 to 4. Select a winner. And so on until the \"playoff\" is done. The music source should be similar to music you play. If you are all over the place, well.... more work.

DRA

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It's all fun and games... til someone looses an eye.


FOH:
A&H MixWiz3 16:2
DriveRack 260
QSC PLX3102 (2) - Yorkville Elite E12 (4)
QSC PLX3602 - Yorkville UCS1 (2)

Monitors:
Driverack PA (2)
Yorkville NX25P (2)

DJ rack:
Q-SpandII
Driverack PA


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 7:17 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2006 6:01 pm
Posts: 4822
Location: Northern Minnesota
Not sure Dra... but you sure are making me scratch my head theses days...so... you saying do a 3 way system? because that's what I would suggest...I mean those Yamies aren't really true subs...in the strictest sense... In my experience, front loaded boxes with anything smaller than a 4\" voice coil are not capable of that bone crunching low end...that rattle you teeth, heart punch is just not possible, and tha6t is what a sub is to me.

Not sure why, but (well I am but it kinda ticks me off) but Yamaha doesn't publish continuous power ratings, and with a 10 db down spec of 30hz your probably going to end up with a 35hz (minimum) HPF.. (and 40 would probably sound better) I find that with my 4 way systems I end up @ 55-65 hz LPF for the subs...and then 120 hz to my 12\" 2 way tops...

As Dra indicated some experimentation will be necessary.. but UNLIKE Dra 8) I think it's pretty easy and fun... :wink:

Enjoy, and let us know how it goes...Just make sure all the cones are moving in the same direction at the same time...with all those drivers... one out of phase can raise total hell with the system...

Gadget

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 7:48 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:11 pm
Posts: 3244
Quote, \"New to the DRPA+ thing\".

Yes, I was definately saying try both a 3-way and a 2-way. The only ranges I listed were for the Bose as a low-mid.

The only Pro-Bose I have experience with are discontinued. Nice of Bose to support only the most recent discontinued model and not the ones from 10+ yrs. It was similar in appearence to the 502B, but not as square and, I think, had 2) 12's and had a larger exit opening. They did sound really nice, though. Really tight.

_________________
It's all fun and games... til someone looses an eye.


FOH:
A&H MixWiz3 16:2
DriveRack 260
QSC PLX3102 (2) - Yorkville Elite E12 (4)
QSC PLX3602 - Yorkville UCS1 (2)

Monitors:
Driverack PA (2)
Yorkville NX25P (2)

DJ rack:
Q-SpandII
Driverack PA


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 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 09, 2009 1:55 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:29 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
After rereading the suggestions from Bose I am leaning toward the 3way and bypassing the Bose processor for the 502's. I'm waiting for the UPS guy to show up so I can let the games begin.

thanks for help. I will let you know how everything comes out.

Darryl


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 Post subject: Wholly Smokes!
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:12 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:29 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
Well, I ended up changing the configuration so that the 802s and 502s are running from the high side of the DPRA+ to the Bose processor to 3 channels of amplification and the Yamaha SW118s from the low side of the DRPA+ to the 4th channel of amplification and it sounds pretty good.

Bose 802c 125-16K
Bose 502B 55-125
Yamaha SW118 31.5-100

Thanks guys for your taking the time to answer my questions.

Darryl


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 4:58 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:11 pm
Posts: 3244
Over-lapping the 55-100hz is probably causing some major phasing issues. You have a bandpass box working with (well, against) a front loaded box.

DRA

_________________
It's all fun and games... til someone looses an eye.


FOH:
A&H MixWiz3 16:2
DriveRack 260
QSC PLX3102 (2) - Yorkville Elite E12 (4)
QSC PLX3602 - Yorkville UCS1 (2)

Monitors:
Driverack PA (2)
Yorkville NX25P (2)

DJ rack:
Q-SpandII
Driverack PA


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 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Any suggestions on how to detect phase issues?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:30 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:29 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
The 802/502 combination is still going through the Bose processor so the 502 is not seeing the drpa. My thoughts here were that the Bose system has always sounded pretty nice on its own just lacked bottom end. I did play around with running the 502 out of the dpra on the low side from 40-125 but it seemed muddy so the 502 went back to the Bose processor where it was designed to be. When adding the SW118's, a buddy of mine and I took the factory 27 preset and made some adjustments to the x-over and the eq. Were going back at noon today to make final adjustments before the first show tonight.

The true test will be Saturday when the band I run sound for is playing outdoors. I have always just used the 802/502 configuration for the band with no complaints until we did a show on the 4th using a massive Carvin TRx system with a DRPA. Everyone loved the sound which put me in a pickle. I know that my system is much too small to duplicate that massive sound, but this is a good starting place.

There is a gentleman who has a set of Yamaha S215 tops for sale that I am considering but don't know if they will be as smooth on the top end as the Bose.

Sorry to be so long winded.

Darryl


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2009 7:42 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 29, 2006 3:11 pm
Posts: 3244
You missed the point, I think.
Set up the Bose system, as is, out of the DRPA high output. Set the HPF on the x-over to 60hz LR24. Set the Low output from the DRPA > Yammies on the x-over to HPF 35hz BW18 and LPF 60hz LR24.

DRA

_________________
It's all fun and games... til someone looses an eye.


FOH:
A&H MixWiz3 16:2
DriveRack 260
QSC PLX3102 (2) - Yorkville Elite E12 (4)
QSC PLX3602 - Yorkville UCS1 (2)

Monitors:
Driverack PA (2)
Yorkville NX25P (2)

DJ rack:
Q-SpandII
Driverack PA


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: DRPA+ wont respond
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 4:46 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:29 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
Well, I attempted to change the x-over points per an earlier post at a show on Saturday but the DPRA would not respond. I left things well enough alone to get through the show. I hope to make some changes this Thursday but may need to start over with factory preset 27 and go from there. The sound was pretty good on Saturday. The highs were much brighter than I have ever heard from my 802's and the lows were tight but I did notice that the amp was clipping on the 502's. I need to make some adjustments on the mid bass but think that Dra's suggestion could remedy that.


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